2010 SS engine in a thirdgen

11634 Views 19 Replies 10 Participants Last post by IROCDave, Oct 15, 2010

sk8r_fer_life

Discussion Starter · Aug 1, 2010

hey guys does anyone know if there is a Kmember setup to do this swap? and what else would I need?

1 - 20 of 20 Posts

89RS

· #2 · Aug 2, 2010 (Edited)

Thirdgen.org has several threads on this subject. Yes there are aftermarket K-members from BMR & Spohn for this, but on TGO they also document the mods you can make to a stock K-member to get it to work.

LS3's aren't cheap though. The cheapest all-in-one package out there is the E-Rod package and its $8400 for the engine, headers, harness & ECU. It'll be another $600 for the K-member and thats assuming you can salvage the accessories and what not from an LS1 4th gen. Assuming you can't and that the E-Rod supplied headers don't fit, its almost $2k for LSx swap headers for a third gen and a GMPP LS accessory drive kit.

There are alot of costs to look at before doing this kind of swap.

WRAITHSS

· #3 · Aug 2, 2010

I have a BMR in my 3rd gen. I have seen both and went with bmr. :thumbsup:

80s_Adam

· #4 · Aug 2, 2010

Wow this is awesome, anybody have them complete yet?

WRAITHSS

· #5 · Aug 2, 2010

80s_Adam said:
Wow this is awesome, anybody have them complete yet?

What do you mean complete?

BMR Sales

· #6 · Aug 3, 2010

Like everyone said I can get you all the stuff you need to bolt the LS3 motor into the car. Other then that you are going to need quite a few other things like engine harness, computer, and some fuel system parts. That pretty much covers the big parts needed. Use Thirdgen.org to help you out, there have been quite a few guys there who have done the LS swap on their 3rd gens.

Devryn

· #7 · Aug 3, 2010

Any LS based engine K-Member will work. The LS3 isn't special. I don't personally care for their drive by wire system for swaps. LS1s are a dime a dozen, and 6.0L LS based truck blocks are super easy to find.

OverAnxious

· #8 · Aug 3, 2010

Should be like any other LS swap, plenty of kits/parts are out there. L99 may be a little cheaper

89RS

· #9 · Aug 3, 2010

OverAnxious said:
L99 may be a little cheaper

As far as getting a transmission to fit, you can buy a crank adapter and LSx swap flexplate for an auto transmission. But the harness, ECU, and other assorted items aren't easy to find. The L99 isn't a crate engine for a reason. Not many people out there are looking at using AFM in an LSx swap.

demonspeed

· #10 · Aug 4, 2010

I don't see the point of doing the LS3 other than the novelty of saying you swapped a LS3. There are much better builds that you could do with a LS-based engine considering the amount of work that's required to do the swap. Couple that with the fact of the price of a LS3 crate -- you could have a wild setup.

sk8r_fer_life

Discussion Starter · #11 · Aug 15, 2010

if I had the money I'd do the swap in a heartbeat but I was just wondering for future reference xD

firechicken

· #12 · Aug 16, 2010

demonspeed said:
I don't see the point of doing the LS3 other than the novelty of saying you swapped a LS3. There are much better builds that you could do with a LS-based engine considering the amount of work that's required to do the swap. Couple that with the fact of the price of a LS3 crate -- you could have a wild setup.

yup, 6.0 iron truck engine $700, ls6 aftermarket heads $1500, cam $300, pushrods $100. lsx fast 90mm intake and 90mm tb $1200. good tune $500

450 REAR WHEEL HP or about 525 to the crank....

what is an ls3 engine? 7k and you make about 380 rwhp.

sk8r_fer_life

Discussion Starter · #13 · Sep 28, 2010

firechicken said:
yup, 6.0 iron truck engine $700, ls6 aftermarket heads $1500, cam $300, pushrods $100. lsx fast 90mm intake and 90mm tb $1200. good tune $500

450 REAR WHEEL HP or about 525 to the crank....

what is an ls3 engine? 7k and you make about 380 rwhp.

its the engine in the 2010 SS camaro and it makes about $8-9k and akes 425+HP

89RS

· #14 · Sep 28, 2010

sk8r_fer_life said:
its the engine in the 2010 SS camaro and it makes about $8-9k and akes 425+HP

The engine in the 2010 SS is the LS3. It makes anywhere from 426FWHP to well over 500FWHP depending on which variant you buy (the 2010 SS is rated at 426FWHP). The only legal version of the engine avaliable for an engine swap is the LS3 E-Rod engine. The engine is a crate LS3 along with headers, harness, ECU, emissions stuff, and everything else but the accessory drive. The engine lists for $8359.95.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/NAL-19244805/

Devryn

· #15 · Sep 28, 2010

89RS said:
The engine in the 2010 SS is the LS3. It makes anywhere from 426FWHP to well over 500FWHP depending on which variant you buy (the 2010 SS is rated at 426FWHP). The only legal CRATE version of the engine avaliable for an engine swap is the LS3 E-Rod engine. The engine is a crate LS3 along with headers, harness, ECU, emissions stuff, and everything else but the accessory drive. The engine lists for $8359.95.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/NAL-19244805/

Fixed it for you. There's no reason a complete junkyard pullout would not be legal.

OverAnxious

· #16 · Sep 28, 2010

89RS said:
As far as getting a transmission to fit, you can buy a crank adapter and LSx swap flexplate for an auto transmission. But the harness, ECU, and other assorted items aren't easy to find. The L99 isn't a crate engine for a reason. Not many people out there are looking at using AFM in an LSx swap.

Never said crate engine. There are L99 motors from wrecks and cars that have done motor swaps already

89RS

· #17 · Sep 28, 2010

Devryn said:
Fixed it for you. There's no reason a complete junkyard pullout would not be legal.

Actually, there is a(are) federal law(s) that states what you can and cannot do to a car as far as the engine goes:

madmax @ TGO said:
Memo 1A.
This refers to a U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) memorandum that says it's illegal to remove, disconnect or disable a required emissions control device on any pollution controlled motor vehicle (PCMV), pretty much any 1968 (1966 in California) or later model year car/light duty vehicle used on public roads. What this means is that even if you don't have a local emissions-testing requirement, technically you can still break federal law by chucking/disabling your vehicle's smog equipment.

Federal Emissions Requirements.
If your area has emissions testing, almost certainly some form of underhood inspection goes along with it. Technicians will check to make sure that all required smog equipment is installed and functioning properly. This does not mean you can't change things! You just have to make sure changes you make are smog legal and comply with Memo 1A. Because you may need to prove compliance to an inspector, most product manufacturers offer documentation that states their products are at least "49-state smog legal," effectively claiming that their products satisfy the EPA requirements. One warning: Products that claim 49-state smog legality are not legal for use in California (or states that use California emissions standards) on PCMVs.

California (CARB) Emissions Requirements.
If you live in California or states that use California emissions standards, then Memo 1A/49-state smog legal isn't enough. Your product must have an Executive Order (EO) number issued by the California Air Resources Board to be legal for use on a PCMV, unless it can be considered a replacement part. That means the manufacturer of the product must obtain an EO number before the product can be advertised or sold in California. The manufacturer must also provide an underhood label with the part that inspectors can use to verify that it's appropriate for the vehicle it's on. Products that have EOs are often called "50-state smog legal" because having an EO satisfies both California and EPA requirements. This is pretty cut and dried except for some products like intake manifolds, which can qualify as replacement parts even though they're made by aftermarket companies. In these cases, many aftermarket companies include documentation explaining the status of these parts.

http://www.thirdgen.org/techboard/engine-swap/165083-questions-about-smog-laws.html

Post number 5 in that thread is also by madmax and he links the actual federal law about legal engine modifications.

So for those of us who don't live in CA, we have to have the manufacturer emissions devices on any engine 1968 or newer. Those of use who live in CA have to have the manufacturer emissions deveices on any engine 1966 or newer. I highly doubt anyone on this forum is going to also slavage the emissions system since the exhaust is technically part of the emissions system.

Unless you are pulling everything out of an identical year car, you have to use a new engine according to the law.

BTW, I had already pointed out that the LS3 E-Rod is a crate engine.

Devryn

· #18 · Sep 28, 2010

89RS said:
Actually, there is a(are) federal law(s) that states what you can and cannot do to a car as far as the engine goes:

http://www.thirdgen.org/techboard/engine-swap/165083-questions-about-smog-laws.html

Post number 5 in that thread is also by madmax and he links the actual federal law about legal engine modifications.

So for those of us who don't live in CA, we have to have the manufacturer emissions devices on any engine 1968 or newer. Those of use who live in CA have to have the manufacturer emissions deveices on any engine 1966 or newer. I highly doubt anyone on this forum is going to also slavage the emissions system since the exhaust is technically part of the emissions system.

Unless you are pulling everything out of an identical year car, you have to use a new engine according to the law.

BTW, I had already pointed out that the LS3 E-Rod is a crate engine.

ONCE AGAIN, there is nothing you say there that indicates a junkyard pullout is illegal. Maybe in California, but *** California. As long as your emissions equipment isn't disabled, or in an engine swap, lower than what you're replacing, it is PERFECTLY LEGAL to do a complete pullout from a junkyard.

firechicken

· #19 · Sep 29, 2010

Devryn said:
ONCE AGAIN, there is nothing you say there that indicates a junkyard pullout is illegal. Maybe in California, but *** California. As long as your emissions equipment isn't disabled, or in an engine swap, lower than what you're replacing, it is PERFECTLY LEGAL to do a complete pullout from a junkyard.

My 02 ls1/t56 harness, gas tank, driveshaft, radiator, exhaust and fans all were pulled out of a 2002 ws6 trans am, they were swapped into a third gen (my car) and tested for emissions (and passed) in california. junkyard pull is completely legal, and as long as it passes emisions your ok. hope this helps..

I live in a small town, we dont have to report to emissions testing, so I installed some long tubes, axed the cats off, and removed the Air system.
I kept all that stuff just incase someday the make it manditory in our town.

IROCDave

· #20 · Oct 15, 2010

The OP wont be doing this swap, he is just dreaming about it. Swapping to a LS based engine buying new parts will quickley drain the wallet of 10K plus.

I am really considering swapping a 6 litre LSx engine into my wifes IROC convertible. If I can pick up a low mileage complete with ECM 6.0 for under 500.00 bucks I will do it, just havent found one yet. LS3 heads, intake, injectors and TB cost about 1500.00 through GMPP, cam runs about 350.00 new. The accessorie drive will cost about a grand, K member, headers another 1500.00. It will run like a raped ape though.

My brother installed a ported set of LS3 heads and cam on his bolt on 05 GTO and ran a 12.1 on the first and only pass. He is going back to the track this weekend, should be well into the 11 with some seat time in it. 6.0's run HARD with newer heads and cam, heads are the key and you can pick them up cheaper than a good set of old school SBC heads.

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