[JVcmro]

For those of you who saw this special last night on CNBC it’s great to see that GM is finally starting to do the right thing. The first and most important step is writing off those union contracts and setting workers wages to reflect the competitive auto market by reducing pay from 28.00 per hour to 14.00.

A professional with a Bachelor degree starts out at 28.00+ an hour, that's not a pay rate for general labor with a high school diploma. This is why Japan and other countries have us over a barrel when it comes to quality and price. All the money that GM was spending in labor for the past 30+ years should have gone into adding quality materials into the cars and more innovative designs. For those of you who might say $14.00 isn’t enough to live on then I would respectfully say that maybe they should find another line of work or better educate themselves and learn to live within there means because their are plenty of hard working people in other areas such as retail that would love the opportunity to make 14.00 an hour.
I feel that many union workers think they are entitled to make more then the common person and have an arrogance about then when it comes to wages just because they belong to a union. I have to say that it's a privilege and there work and quality should reflect all the compensation they receive but it doesn’t. Well maybe now it will.

 

[geerhed]

AMEN!

 

[OverAnxious]

http://www.5thgen.org/forum/showthread.php?t=6974

http://www.5thgen.org/forum/showthread.php?t=7353

 

[golfaholic]

Sorry this is a brief side note......thanks to whichever moderator who quickly got rid of that moron trying to sell his stuff........another reason why I really appreciate being a member of this site...............sorry, back to the CNBC discussion.:hello:

 

[lionfan22]

I totally agree with you JVcmro. I know a lot of hard working folks that work at the GM truck plant in Ft.Wayne IN. I don't want to see anyone lose his/her job, but the arrogance that some of the workers have really chaps my $#%. Especially when they complain about not being compensated fairly....unfortunatly for some, reality is about to bite them in the #$$.

 

[CUONCRS]

What's better, not being compensated "fairly", or not being compensated at all?

It still chaps my @$$ that statement that said that GM posted a 23 million dollar loss, but Rick Wagoner still got paid 16 million. He should get a basic salary (2-300k), and then share in profits. No profits, no huge paycheck.

He gets 16 million in 1 year. Let's say instead, he gets 1 million, and the average salary for a line worker is 50k. Guess what, that 15 million is 300 people.

When is enough too much?

 

[JVcmro]

What's better, not being compensated "fairly", or not being compensated at all?

It still chaps my @$$ that statement that said that GM posted a 23 million dollar loss, but Rick Wagoner still got paid 16 million. He should get a basic salary (2-300k), and then share in profits. No profits, no huge paycheck.

He gets 16 million in 1 year. Let's say instead, he gets 1 million, and the average salary for a line worker is 50k. Guess what, that 15 million is 300 people.

When is enough too much?

That 16mill I think includes everything not just base salary, believe it or not that’s an average CEO salary

 

[Devryn]

What's better, not being compensated "fairly", or not being compensated at all?

It still chaps my @$$ that statement that said that GM posted a 23 million dollar loss, but Rick Wagoner still got paid 16 million. He should get a basic salary (2-300k), and then share in profits. No profits, no huge paycheck.

He gets 16 million in 1 year. Let's say instead, he gets 1 million, and the average salary for a line worker is 50k. Guess what, that 15 million is 300 people.

When is enough too much?

Actually, they posted a $15.5 BILLION dollar loss. I agree with you somewhat though. Someone who's as well off as that man should go without a salary for a few years. Let's face it...He's not living paycheck to paycheck.

 

[Jonz5GEN]

Let's face it...He's not living paycheck to paycheck.

LOL!

You think?

 

[justgreat]

everyone wants a slice of the american pie....wagoner's slice is 16 million a year...blame the guy on the line, that makes sense...


jackg
06 sts6

 

[el ess X]

The guy on the line is the one not going to jail if something goes awry though. It's never easy when things are going badly.

Here's the NY-minute skinny on how executive salaries work. They work for the profits. They come up with an idea, then employ the grunt labor to help get that idea to fruition. If they abandon an idea, the workers working on it are no longer needed, thus resources allocated elsewhere and the workers get laid off or cut back, etc. The labor force takes the hit. It's no different than the mom and pop store with the one hired kid sweeping the storeroom. The kid works for them. If mom and pop make a ton of money, the kid might get a bonus, but still has the same hourly wage. Mom and pop make the dough. So does the leadership team at most companies. It's just how it works. Is it fair? Depends on which side of the fence you're on.

From a psychological standpoint and a show of unity, a CEO goodwill gesture such as taking a reduction in salary would be a good move PR-wise. A mere drop in the bucket. After all, the fat cats are the ones getting fat. They merely employ the help. They're not going to pay the help as much as they would pay themselves. Would you? If they could do it without hiring help, don't you think they would?

This is not defending any CEO's salary, but if you want someone to take the heat like they do and make those kinds of decisions, you have to be willing to pay them to make it worth their while. They have many more stakeholders to worry about keeping happy than just the guy on the line, but he is one of them.

 

[super60]

For those of you who saw this special last night on CNBC it’s great to see that GM is finally starting to do the right thing. The first and most important step is writing off those union contracts and setting workers wages to reflect the competitive auto market by reducing pay from 28.00 per hour to 14.00.

A professional with a Bachelor degree starts out at 28.00+ an hour, that's not a pay rate for general labor with a high school diploma. This is why Japan and other countries have us over a barrel when it comes to quality and price. All the money that GM was spending in labor for the past 30+ years should have gone into adding quality materials into the cars and more innovative designs. For those of you who might say $14.00 isn’t enough to live on then I would respectfully say that maybe they should find another line of work or better educate themselves and learn to live within there means because their are plenty of hard working people in other areas such as retail that would love the opportunity to make 14.00 an hour.
I feel that many union workers think they are entitled to make more then the common person and have an arrogance about then when it comes to wages just because they belong to a union. I have to say that it's a privilege and there work and quality should reflect all the compensation they receive but it doesn’t. Well maybe now it will.

As a Oshawa Ontario GM worker assigned to the Camaro team i take acceptation to your statement and others on this site. Please don't make some harebrained opinion by saying we ( GM WORKERs) are lazy and over paid. The quality and performance of the new Camaro will be top notch. A ton of work is being done to get this right and alot of it is by the blue collar type you mention. I'm proud to be a part of this team and will put 120 % into the finished product so you and the others here can drive the most prestigious sports car GM has built. And for the record i only have a high school education(along with most of the other workers) but have spent 25 yrs helping to built Chevys . Most of those yrs have been spent at the plant working 6 days a week making sure that YOU THE CUSTOMER has his/her vehicle !! Until you work in a plant building between 400-500 floor pans ,doors,decklids,hoods,shocktowers, etc.. with no air conditioning or two 10 min breaks during an eight hr shift then please don't be too fast to judge others.

I promise not to criticize your job or make statments along the lines of being lazy and overpaid ..

i'm thankful to be working at GM and proud to be working on the new 5thGEN you won't be disappointed.

 

[Devryn]

As a Oshawa Ontario GM worker assigned to the Camaro team i take acceptation to your statement and others on this site. Please don't make some harebrained opinion by saying we ( GM WORKERs) are lazy and over paid. The quality and performance of the new Camaro will be top notch. A ton of work is being done to get this right and alot of it is by the blue collar type you mention. I'm proud to be a part of this team and will put 120 % into the finished product so you and the others here can drive the most prestigious sports car GM has built. And for the record i only have a high school education(along with most of the other workers) but have spent 25 yrs helping to built Chevys . Most of those yrs have been spent at the plant working 6 days a week making sure that YOU THE CUSTOMER has his/her vehicle !! Until you work in a plant building between 400-500 floor pans ,doors,decklids,hoods,shocktowers, etc.. with no air conditioning or two 10 min breaks during an eight hr shift then please don't be too fast to judge others.

I promise not to criticize your job or make statments along the lines of being lazy and overpaid ..

i'm thankful to be working at GM and proud to be working on the new 5thGEN you won't be disappointed.

He didn't call you or any of your comrades lazy. I think you missed the whole point, but the UAW people always tend to.

 

[super60]

He didn't call you or any of your comrades lazy. I think you missed the whole point, but the UAW people always tend to.

I knew you would find something to throw at the UAW/CAW ! The statement about not being worth our hourly rate was my first hint ! You non-GM types always tend to bring that up....

 

[$¢'s 5th Gen]

He didn't call you or any of your comrades lazy. I think you missed the whole point, but the UAW people always tend to.

He didnt call them lazy but it sounded like he said they are not worth the money they make, and because a Bachelor degree person only makes 28 an hr right out of school. I dont think there is anything wrong with someone who has put in there time, making as much as someone GREEN right out of college.
And is 28 an hour for a new hire or someone who has a few years under their belt?
My worry is if they cut the pay in 1/2 then you will have very low morale and probably a lower quality product. Low morale in the work place doesn't eqaul high quality work with pride.

 

[Devryn]

Dude...A line worker with no education makes $28 an hour...None of the foreign competition with factories in the US make anywhere near that. I get it, you defend you and your own. I'm not attacking, but I'm saying for an uneducated worker right out of high school, that kind of hourly wage is ridiculous, especially when the company is struggling.

The UAW is even MORE genious when they go on strike because GM won't guarantee the number of cars or trucks that a particular factory will be ordered to produce. Why would they commit to producing 100,000 trucks when they don't know if they could sell that many? From my standpoint, which can only be based on media coverage and not personal experience or knowledge, there's too much going into wages and benefits, and the UAW demands are too high.

For f's sake, you've got educated professional public employees in California who were just reduced to working MINIMUM WAGE because of their budget crisis.

Bottom line, many of the factory workers are in the job because it paid well and didn't require them to get any further in their education or better themselves in any way.

 

[mdennis10]

As a Oshawa Ontario GM worker assigned to the Camaro team i take acceptation to your statement and others on this site. Please don't make some harebrained opinion by saying we ( GM WORKERs) are lazy and over paid. The quality and performance of the new Camaro will be top notch. A ton of work is being done to get this right and alot of it is by the blue collar type you mention. I'm proud to be a part of this team and will put 120 % into the finished product so you and the others here can drive the most prestigious sports car GM has built. And for the record i only have a high school education(along with most of the other workers) but have spent 25 yrs helping to built Chevys . Most of those yrs have been spent at the plant working 6 days a week making sure that YOU THE CUSTOMER has his/her vehicle !! Until you work in a plant building between 400-500 floor pans ,doors,decklids,hoods,shocktowers, etc.. with no air conditioning or two 10 min breaks during an eight hr shift then please don't be too fast to judge others.

I promise not to criticize your job or make statments along the lines of being lazy and overpaid ..

i'm thankful to be working at GM and proud to be working on the new 5thGEN you won't be disappointed.

AMEN brother. coming from another blue collar worker you guys build dreams and are the un-sung hero's of the automobile industriesatriot:. Thank You!:roxor:

 

[Jinx]

Moderator Response:
Im closing the thread on the basis that this is going to just turn into a UAW/CAW, Union debate.............which has been beaten like a dead horse. Keeping the peace.